Topics: Federal funding for health, COAG meeting, ABCC Bill and negotiations with the Senate crossbenchers.
E&OE…
DEL IRANI
State premiers, chief ministers, and the Prime Minister are preparing to meet for the latest Council of Australian Governments talks on Friday. The Minister for Vocational Education and Skills, Scott Ryan, joins us now from Parliament House in Canberra – good morning Minister.
MINISTER RYAN
Good morning.
IRANI
Could you please confirm that the Government will offer the states a funding deal on hospitals on Friday?
RYAN
I cannot confirm that, the report in the paper this morning alludes to discussions that have been ongoing between officials at the commonwealth and state level over the last few weeks and also alludes to the meeting that will happen later this week between the Prime Minister and the premiers. It is a regular COAG meeting, these funding tussles have been something that has been happening for longer than I have been alive. But it is important to remember that what we are talking about here is about changes to the rate of growth in health spending. Because, year on year Commonwealth spending on health and hospitals continues to increase, now the premiers want more money, that has always been the case, but at the same time the Commonwealth has a Budget situation that it needs to take into account.
IRANI
If money is offered to the premiers, what would they have to do in return to get that extra funding?
RYAN
One of the things the Prime Minister has talked about and the Treasurer has talked about, and the Health Minister has talked about, is that we can make our health system and particularly our hospital system more effective. It is a constant battle to see resources are spent in the most effective way possible. We know, for example, that thousands of people go into hospital every year because of mistakes with medicine and medication, thousands of people go to hospital avoidably every year because we do not have the strongest management plans for chronic diseases like diabetes. Thousands of people go back to hospital after they have been released because there has been a complication. Now, it is not just about the amount of money we spend, it is about making our hospital system more effective and more efficient because every dollar, every admission we can save that is avoidable we can actually direct to a person who is waiting for treatment.
IRANI
Minister, what is the long-term solution to funding health? I mean if the $5 billion deal is even on the table, Jay Weatherill has said that it is just a Band-Aid on a much bigger problem like you were pointing out.
RYAN
The state premiers have always, it doesn’t matter what persuasion they are, they have always asked for more money from the Commonwealth. But it’s not sustainable to be borrowing money when the Commonwealth has got a Budget deficit, to continually chip in to a hospital system. The states also need to ensure that their hospital system is operating at the most efficient and effective level it can. And the truth is, all around the world and for as long as politics has been around in Australia we have always had these debates about funding levels and how we make that funding used as efficiently as possible. There is no silver bullet to these problems, it will be a constant ongoing dialogue and that will culminate this week in the Prime Minister meeting with the state premiers.
IRANI
Talking about funding levels, what about education, is the Commonwealth going to offer anything there?
RYAN
Again, let’s wait to see what happens with the Prime Minister and the premiers but in education we have seen substantial increases in real terms – both at a system-wide level and a per student basis – over the last two decades. And our results have not actually increased, they have in fact slipped back. What this Government is about, both in schools and in hospitals is ensuring that the money and the resources that we direct are actually measured against the outcomes that they achieve. There is no point in constantly tipping money into a system when we know it is not being used as efficiently as possible. With respect to education, there are demands on the system and in my previous role, as I have worked with issues like students with disabilities, and the Government will have something to say about the ongoing funding of schools in the Budget.
IRANI
Labor has already committed to funding the full six years of the so-called Gonski program, will the Government match that?
RYAN
I have got to say, that is what Federal Labor says, but the money is not there to pay for it. This is the problem we have, there is no national funding system under the so-called Gonski arrangements, there are twenty-seven different funding arrangements. And at the state levels we see state Labor governments not matching even the commitments that they themselves have made with funding increases. What we need is a truly national system, and that is what Simon Birmingham has been talking about, because what we have as a legacy from the previous Labor government is different rates of funding, different transition arrangements for different students in different states. And indeed, under Labor’s arrangements, Queensland, the Northern Territory, and Western Australia were left out of it.
IRANI
Alright, well Minister on the Bill to reintroduce the building industry watchdog, what approach is the Government taking there with the Senate crossbench to try and get that deal through?
RYAN
We are taking the approach that we have taken now for the last two and a half years which is to negotiate in good faith with the crossbench. The test is simply: do amendments actually strengthen the Bill with relation to the construction sector? It employs a million people, it is responsible for a third of our economic growth and it is particularly critical in cities like my home town of Melbourne where lawlessness has reached unprecedented levels, and we saw our CBD almost shut down for illegal strikes a couple of years ago. But at the same time we do need six of the eight crossbenchers to vote for both any amendments that strengthen the Bill and for the Bill itself. And the Prime Minister last week made it clear that if that doesn’t occur over the next three weeks that the Senate has been recalled to deliberate on this, then the Constitution provides a mechanism to resolve that and the issue is taken to the people at an election.
IRANI
But are you willing to negotiate with the crossbench?
RYAN
Absolutely. The test is: does it strengthen to Bill with relation to its application to the construction sector and does it actually help the passage of the Bill? The Prime Minister made clear that the games in the Senate have to stop. That incident last week where were sitting overnight for 32 hours straight was something out of student politics at universities, it was juvenile by the Labor Party. They are not interested in passing the Bill or amendments, the Greens are not interested in passing the Bill or any amendments, and so we need six of the eight crossbenchers.
IRANI
And so are you serious about getting this through and avoiding a double dissolution election?
RYAN
As the Prime Minister said, our preference is to see this Bill adopted. The Howard government legislated it, Bill Shorten and the Greens got rid of it as they were kowtowing to the CFMEU. Illegality has gone up on our building sites; our priority is to see the ABCC reinstated. Now, if the Senate does not do that, the people will make their decision at an election.
IRANI
Alright, Minister Scott Ryan, thank you for your time this morning.
RYAN
Thanks for having me.
(ENDS)